I Seek Out Spaces that Offer a Sense of Relief: An Interview with Ewa Dziarnowska

ewa_dziarnowska_104bis.jpg, default, Ewa Dziarnowska in the 'This resting, patience' performance, which premiered on 13 January 2024 at the Tanztage Festival, Sophiensaele, Berlin, photo:

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Three hours. No fixed stage. No fixed seats. And two dancers who just keep going. Ahead of ‘This resting, patience’ at Malta Festival in Poznań (27–28 June), Ewa Dziarnowska talks rest, resistance, and what it means to simply be in a room together.

The Berlin-based Polish choreographer Ewa Dziarnowska’s work keeps asking the same quietly radical question: what can happen between people when you take the pressure off? Her show This resting, patience has already made its way through Oslo, Stockholm, Vienna and the Santarcangelo Festival in Italy as part of the Focus on Poland programme. Now, for the first time, she will be performing it in Poland at the Malta Festival in Poznań.

Wiktoria Tabak: Rest and patience – these two words are in the title of your work. It seems to me that they could be viewed as potential forms of resistance against unbridled capitalism. What does this title mean to you?

Ewa Dziarnowska: I don’t really like thinking up titles because they instantly define what I create and influence people’s interpretations of it. This time, the title is taken from some graffiti I happened to notice in Lisbon a few years ago: ‘This resting, patience is made of what you said but never deliver.’

In a certain sense, it refers to heartbreak and unfulfilled promises, but also simply to the economy of attention. How long are we able to concentrate on a performance? How do we perceive it? What do we expect from it? How quickly do we grow bored of it?

The anti-capitalist perspective was also important here. I wanted to create a space where we could be together, feel a sense of relief, and breathe freely. And to find ways of spending time together in one place – ways that would help us momentarily set aside social and political polarisation.

WT: I asked you about rest because, in the performance, you and Leah Marojević dance for three hours straight, testing the limits of your bodies and exploring your relationship with the space and the audience. In this context, the word struck me as a kind of play on expectations or preconceptions.

ED: I usually build my relationship with dance through practice in the studio, which has a somewhat meditative quality. Sometimes I feel that I don’t dance to express something, but rather to understand what’s inside me – to see what dance can teach me in a particular moment. It’s a demanding, three-hour project, but its structure is conceived in such a way that performing individual sections can also be relaxing for us. Besides, the audience is also able to relax during the performance.

Once, at the ImPulsTanz Festival in Vienna, I watched an intimate piece by Angela Schubot Vitovec. My friends were performing in it – they were wearing tracksuits, and the whole atmosphere was totally relaxed and stress-free. The audience sat wherever they liked and the performers moved around freely, sometimes interacting with us. Amid all the noise and commotion of the festival, this gave me a huge feeling of relief and pleasure. I think I’ve carried something of that experience over into my own work. In fact, whenever I’m working on something of my own, I first ask myself what I’m currently enjoying watching.

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Ewa Dziarnowska & Leah Marojević's performance 'This resting, patience', which premiered on 13 January 2024 at the Tanztage Festival, Sophiensaele, Berlin, photo: Spyros Rennt

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WT: In your show, there isn’t a clearly defined boundary between the stage and the audience – people can come and go as they please. What kind of impact does that have on you during the performance?

ED: We have safeguards, guidelines we follow, but we never quite know how our work will be received. A lot depends on the audience. For a long time, I’ve been interested in a more democratic, non-hierarchical approach to being on stage. I try to avoid thinking of performance in terms of visibility, expertise or privilege. I think of myself as just one of many people in the room doing something – opening others up to collaborative movement. I perform very well when I’ve got many friends in the audience with whom I’ve danced before, because I feel a lot of support from them.

But for me, everything in This resting, patience is mainly about relationships. It’s about the people we spend time with, how we feel about them, and what we do with our emotions. We don’t force anyone to participate. For us, it’s about simply being together in the same space. That’s why we have to give something of ourselves first, invite the audience into our community, make sure they feel comfortable, break down barriers, and then – see where it goes. It’s deeply moving when, after a while, the audience starts to open up and take part in this process.

Ewa Dziarnowska w przedstawieniu „This resting, patience", premiera: 13 stycznia 2024 podczas Tanztage Festival, Sophiensaele, Berlin, fot. Spyros Rennt

WT: When you were first developing the concept for this piece, did you think about inviting Leah Marojević to collaborate with you right from the very start?

ED: It was originally intended to be a solo project. I met Leah through mutual friends, and I’d also seen her in two performances – her stage presence made a huge impression on me. I thought she was brilliant and I wanted to get to know her better, both professionally and personally. So I rang her up. We hit it off right away. It turned out we had similar experiences – we’d seen the same shows and had a lot in common.

In this piece, we rely heavily on improvisation, using tools we’ve acquired over the years and a sensitivity gained while working on other projects with various people. Leah’s a wonderful dancer – I couldn’t have created this piece without her. And I couldn’t have done it without Krzysztof Bagiński either, who was responsible for the sound, or Jacqueline Sobiszewski, who designed the lighting for us. All of this elevated the performance to a level I certainly wouldn’t have been able to achieve on my own.

WT: You’ve performed this piece in various cities, including Oslo, Stockholm and Vienna. Do you notice any differences in how it’s received in these places?

ED: The way people interact with us and move around is completely different in Berlin than in Munich, where audiences are used to a more conventional approach to choreography. But wherever we present This resting, patience, by the end of the three-hour performance we always succeed in creating a collective experience. Sometimes it takes longer to reach that point, sometimes less.

WT: From what you’re saying, I get the impression that the performative aspect of choreography is what interests you the most.

ED: Definitely. When creating This resting, patience, I thought a lot about the social function of choreography. I’m less interested in watching a technically proficient body perform on stage than in situations where dance can help people connect with one another, have fun, and build relationships with their bodies, the world and other people. During the performance, the audience can approach us and observe our bodies up close – all of this opens up a new way of seeing, creating a more deeply engaged and poetic perspective. It also triggers a different kind of empathy.

WT: I think intimacy is a key element in this project – not just between you and the audience, but also between you and Leah.

ED: It was fascinating for me while working with Leah to observe how she moves, what her movements activate in me, what kind of sensitivity they awaken, and how I begin to perceive the wider landscape when something is right in front of my eyes.

WT: I’d also like to ask you about the dance pieces by other choreographers in which you’ve performed. For example, you’ve worked with Wojtek Grudziński and Alex Baczyński-Jenkins. How does it usually work – do you contribute to these projects conceptually, on a dramaturgical level, or are you given specific tasks to carry out?

ED: It’s different every time. I bring my experience, practical skills, knowledge and contextual understanding to each project – and I help shape them on that level. As I get older, I’m gaining more of an appreciation for people telling me exactly what to do. It gives me an opportunity to learn from them and truly understand how they think. In the past, I didn’t like that. I needed more freedom and minimal instructions imposed on me from above.

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Ewa Dziarnowska & Leah Marojević's performance 'This resting, patience', which premiered on 13 January 2024 at the Tanztage Festival, Sophiensaele, Berlin, photo: Spyros Rennt

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WT: You’ve been living and working primarily in Berlin for many years. But in the past, you were also involved with Stary Browar Nowy Taniec in Poznań – a programme curated by Joanna Leśnierowska. What kind of recollections do you have of that project?

ED: I certainly wouldn’t be where I am today if it weren’t for Stary Browar Nowy Taniec – if I hadn’t attended workshops there and watched all those performances as a teenager. Joanna organised lectures on dance, invited fantastic people and promoted the work of international artists. Few people were doing things like that in Poland back then. There weren’t many places like that, and indeed there still aren’t very many. I was lucky to have ended up there at that time.

WT: Do you feel that a place like that is still missing from the Polish choreography scene today?

ED: Yes, that project was extremely valuable. It’s unfortunate that it ended. For a while, there was a lot happening in Poland in the field of choreography. I used to visit Warsaw quite often back then, working at places such as the Centre for Contemporary Art. And then suddenly everything changed – many venues were shut down, opportunities dwindled. There are brilliant Polish choreographers and dancers who have nowhere to work. I think Komuna Warszawa is probably the only place left where one can still produce an original choreographed performance.

WT: Perhaps this situation will improve after the opening of the new Pavilion of Dance and Other Performing Arts.

ED: Let’s hope so.

WT: I’ve heard that things are looking rather bleak in Berlin these days as well, with cuts being made to funding for cultural projects. But I’m wondering what systemic solutions, based on your experience, might be worth adapting from there and applying to Poland.

ED: Yes, you’re right – Berlin is becoming increasingly conservative. There used to be much more experimental, exploratory art here. However, when it comes to effective practice, I found the situation during the pandemic quite interesting. The support system worked very efficiently here – funds were distributed in a democratic manner. We received smaller amounts, but this meant that more people received support. I think we really need this kind of community-based, social approach to the distribution of grants today. We also need to support one another within the community by offering each other work and sharing resources. In other words: we need to look out for one another.

_{Interview originally conducted in Polish, June 2025, translated by Scotia Gilroy, April 2026}

Language English

polish dance

Polish choreographer and dancer